Tags: the loading bar, korey, videogame, podcast, spill, spill.com, metal gear solid, snake
September 19, 2012 at 7:28 AM, said ...
love this series so much but havent played 4 coz i dont have a ps3 i would highly recommend portable ops and peace walker both are amazing. storyline is pretty difficult to get your head around im no historian or economic major but they do fit the story in really well with political and historical events love this talk will definatly listen to it again
September 18, 2012 at 12:46 AM, said ...
You've got my creative juices flowing with this discussion guys! I was thinking what if there was a game starring The Boss ( like Nick wanted ) set during WWII with her taking on some dangerous black ops organization against the backdrop of the war. After that game "The Patriots" storyline picks up and in the future ( after MGS 4 ) we have a resurgence of the same people The Boss went up against during WWII. The new character has to deal with those people's new power base since they've been building it up in the background while The Patriots rose and fell.
Pretty basic, but Nick was right about the Second World War being fertile land for new story threads and ideas.
September 16, 2012 at 4:39 PM, said ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wMevilu8ock
September 16, 2012 at 4:20 AM, said ...
I have to agree with Jeff about Sunny being the next protagonist. If not her then Raiden's son. Have a few flashbacks to when he/she was being trained by Raiden and Snake during his last few months alive so he/she can play like a mix between Snake and Raiden.
September 15, 2012 at 10:46 PM, Sidney Desmangles said ...
@Luther
You make a great point.I also wished for new IP. I just hope Kojima wont become George Lucas on his own series.
@Joseph E T HughesI love MGS2 and you brought great points about it. I don't think people understand this clearly but in MGS2 you are NOT suppose to play as Snake.At ALL. You're suppose to be this rookie guy that goes through all of those missions and plot twits and all that. It's part what MGS2 is as a story. my only complaint is that they didn't have to make him look so much like a girl and too much romance.But all the other aspects of him served a purpose in the story.
@Jumpercables
I agree, MGR shoots a bit too far away from the tone of the previous games. But I'll go even further and say that it even shoots way too far from its original styleitself. Remember that first trailer that came out at E3? remember how awesome it was? I wonder what Jeff thought of that first trailer.?.e3 vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtM3PGyiQUc And now it turned into all just stupid dialogue and corny punch lines with a gameplay resembling the not so good Ninja Gaiden 3.
September 15, 2012 at 10:33 PM, Agmaster said ...
I really wish Snake would just die. Kojima wants it, why can't people just take that and move on to a new hero? Raiden's appearance bugged me at first, but we see his growth. I'd REALLY like to see Jack the kid soldier if we HAD to go back in time again. In closing, Raiden in MGS2 was great, Kojima overcompensated in 4, give him time to be fleshed out without having to be as good as snake at his job. Snake's Big Boss redux man, Raiden can't be as 'cool'
September 15, 2012 at 4:24 PM, said ...
I would argue the innovation in Metal Gear makes it stand out. Each entry in the series is a tangibly different rodeo, Snake Eater is a much different experience from Guns of the Patriots, as is Peace Walker. In my book, that's a huge difference between MGS and the other games you mentioned, all of which don't change their primary gameplay much.
September 15, 2012 at 4:20 PM, said ...
@Jeff
Are you...you talking to me? This was weird. I started the series with MGS2, so I'm that guy. I, too, got an Metal Gear itch from the Ground Zeroes demo and played Peace Walker for the first time on the HD collection and thought it was totally awesome. I, too, really love MGS4 and don't understand at what point it apparently became a bad game,and I have the same response to the cutscene criticism.
To answer the question about Raiden, while it was obvious Snake was cooler, it was also part of the game's charm that I wasn't expecting a protagonist bait and switch. MGS2 changed my perspective on gaming and storytelling specifically because of how different and innovative it was, and not being afraid to defy my expectations like that was part of it. Do I think Raiden is as cool as Snake? Of course not, Snake's badass stealth camo bungee jump saw to that. Do I hate him? Not particularly. I wasn't super fond of parts of his character arc, but I thought the revelations about his past and his role in the larger story of MGS2 was fascinating. Plus, I thought the game was so amazing that I can't really see myself complaining about any element of it - I was too busy being absolutely blown away. That said, I was as impressed as anybody when Raiden became a hell of a lot cooler in MGS4.
The only tangible difference I seem to have with you is over Revengeance. While I love Metal Gear gameplay, I honestly find no issue with a spin-off with an action-oriented character like cyborg ninja Raiden. It just doesn't seem to bother me that the games are branching out. I would be equally interested in a Metal Gear RTS or RPG, so long as it wasn't a primary entry in the series. Hell, Peace Walker had some light RTS elements, and that was incredible.
September 15, 2012 at 8:31 AM, said ...
I wonder if Jeff has ever played any of the MGS AC!D games & what he thought about them? I really haven't heard anyone talk about them at length & wonder if they actually carry weigh in the universe. I played all the MGS games except AC!D 1 & 2, & wonder what Jeff or you spillios think about it if you played it.
September 15, 2012 at 5:36 AM, said ...
Forgot to add this in my previous post but. Outer Heaven themed mmo. Who's with me?
September 15, 2012 at 5:33 AM, said ...
I don't think I wanna see snake come back at this point. If you asked me before revengence came out I would have told you I'd want raiden to feature as the main character in future solid games. Now I'm not so sure. I was definitely in love the idea of a metal gear themed action game but I feel kinda like it shoots a bit to far away from the tone of the previous games. I haven't gotten to play mgs4 so I can't really speak on sunny as the main character one way or another.
September 15, 2012 at 3:52 AM, said ...
Paz!
September 15, 2012 at 2:17 AM, Sidney Desmangles said ...
Oh I loved Peace Walker, I'm actually going to play it again to refresh my memory on it since it's directly tied in to Ground Zeroes. I originally played it on the PSP when it came out but with the HD collection I find it's even more enjoyable on console with 2 analog sticks.It has a great story too.*Note To New Comers*: I Noticed some of you are interested in the Metal Gear franchise but maybe don't have the time to play all of them to grasp the story so I would strongly recommend you guys to Download the Metal Gear Solid 4 Database on the Playstation Network. It's real easy to use and comes with the full story with pictures and all.and most of all..its free! here's how it looks: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73o3GqQ2AEk
September 15, 2012 at 1:39 AM, Steven O Connell said ...
Was looking forward to listening to this, but then ye said peace walker(the one game I haven't played) is open territory, so i need to get the hd collection before I can enjoy this spoiler free
September 15, 2012 at 1:16 AM, said ...
@Dante16
That's all entirely understandable, but what you have to understand is that while I enjoyed most of the DmC franchise, I'm obviously not as emotionally connected to it as you are. I know a lot of people who don't like the reboot and all I can really say is that I'm not some sort of opinion robot who is emotionally connected to all things equally. That's not meant as an insult or slight towards you, but while I understand what you're saying, I just don't care as much about DmC. It was a fun, goofy, action packed series that never took itself too seriously. I had a great time with the games, but I felt like 4 was starting to drag off into 'what the hell do we do now' territory. So I see the videos of the reboot and it just doesn't make me all that mad. All that being said, at the end of the day it's not my decision. If someone from Capcom calls and asks what I think, I'll be more than happy to tell them I'd rather see the game non-rebooted, because if I had that sort of power I'd prefer that, but that's not a choice I get to make.
September 15, 2012 at 12:17 AM, said ...
Zone of Enders!!! That takes me back man. Good shit!
September 14, 2012 at 11:35 PM, Dante16 said ...
I know I'm way late on the responses here but....
@Professor Jeff The thing is MGR is a spin-off that is supposed to be going off into its own separate franchise. Mario games have dipped into different genres and separate franchises before why can't Metal Gear? I'm a big fan of Metal Gear (although I started on MGS2) and I don't see the problem here. Also MGR isn't hurting the franchise because it's a spin-off and it will never replace MGS.
DmC, on other hand, is ruining the franchise because if the game sells then there will be no more original Devil May Cry. It would be like if MGS was rebooted right before you got an MGS4 to rap up the story. The story of Devil May Cry was never rapped up and Capcom just says to hell with what the fans have been invested in 10 years we are just going to completely reboot to series and disregard everything else. So how in the world can you support DmC when it will completely destroy a franchise that people (like me) have been enjoying for 10 years, and then completely not be supportive of a spin-off that doesn't even hurt your franchise at all.
If MGR fails and it sucks they can just go ahead and say its non-canon while you guys enjoy MGS Ground Zeroes and later MGS5. Sadly we DMC fans do not have that same luxury and we have to accept the death of DMC and have to find other games to give us that similar enjoyment (Bayonetta and Rising). I guess that's what it comes down to. It kind of sucks seeing MG fans not support Rising just because they believe MG can only be about stealth even though it could be the best Hackn'Slash game to come out since Bayonetta.
September 14, 2012 at 11:26 PM, said ...
Oh man just played Peace Walker 2 weeks back and it was so awesome but missions were kinda short I thought.
September 14, 2012 at 11:16 PM, said ...
Yeah I became a fan in high school after playing MGS3 that was an amazing game. I was to young to play the originals but i saw one of my friends father's play MGS. After finishing 3 I reserved my copy of 4 and bought the current games that u could get at the time MGS2 and MGS Twin Snakes. I never looked back.....Kuwabara :)
Say Professor Jeff what where the ridiculous stuff in Twin Snakes you mentioned before from what I recall everything happened like the original? But this is a college student trying to remember a six year olds memory so take what i know with a grain of salt.
September 14, 2012 at 10:50 PM, said ...
@SidMeister
Just out of curiosity, how do you feel about Peace Walker?
September 14, 2012 at 10:28 PM, Sidney Desmangles said ...
@Nikhil Sunil
I never said that Hideo Kojima said that he thinks MGS4 is a bad game. I think its a bad game with too few good parts and I simply pointed out that he was disappointed in it and to the point that he even took off his trade mark title off of the cover art after the first prints (euro & jap).And also its the only Metal Gear game that he ever was disappointed in at least publicly. whether its technical or not. and he doesnt take full credit for the story and gameplay he was CO-Director and CO-writer in mgs4. in previous MGS games he was never Co-anything. Especially not co-director. and I think those are things to think about..He made MGS4 at a time when he wanted to get done with the series and move on to other things and he wanted to pass the franchise to someone else but still needed to have a hand in the project. he even said all that himself. But im kinda glad in way that the only MGS game that the writer of Metal Gear: Ghost Babel co-directed ended up as the weakest in the series (mgs4) because i really think Kojima's been trying really hard to redeem himself for MGS4's lack of innovation..I think thats what made him comeback to the franchise in full..In a "If you want something done right, do it yourself" kind of approach.Now although we disagree on certain things im really glad you mentioned some of the stuff we did agree on.But I want point out a couple things I thought were wrong in some things you said:
-Bad enemy A.I - The A.I was ok. In many ways, it was what we'd come to expect from MGS games. [I disagree, now here's the thing for every metal gear game I always play and have beaten every one of them on Extreme difficulty level. (yes including mgs4) and the Ai is not as bad as you point out in MGS games (even on Normal) the Ai actually did smart things in previous games like call for backup before entering a hostile area divide in groups to fight and they were really hard to beat at times they even used to call alerts as soon as they saw a soldier dead on the floor from a distants (wich anyone in real life would do). But in mgs4 they just ask "Are you okay?" to soldiers iv'e just killed in cold blood and has blood all over him. pretty dumb. theres more but thats one blatant example and that was on the highest difficulty(Big boss extreme).
-Too long cutscenes - Yes agreed on that. -Poor codec content - Also totally agree on wat u said
-Not enough gameplay - You said it was enough but thats arguable. to me it wasnt enough time to use all the items and weapons or at at least most of them. In Mgs3 you fully take advantage of mostly everything with alot of good gameplay time to explore. (Note: But the controls in mgs4 are fantastic tho better than in mgs3 I think)
-Small maps with linear passages - You said "The game is linear but the maps were definetly bigger than they were in MGS3 or any of the previous games. Also, one of the great things about it is because you weren't limited by the power of the PS2, you didn't have a load time every time you went into a new area of a map." [Seriously? mgs3 had way bigger maps because they mastered the PS2s powers at that time.so much so that they need a short intermission between SECTIONS of the same map. And Mgs4 Installs and loads very, VERY often even Professor Jeff pointed that out.
-Easy boss fights - U said it was varied. I disagre MGS2 had way better boos fights! the Harrier,Vamp, The metal gear Rays, Solidus on federal Hall..and they VERY varied and not easy. some of the boos fights are even copies of previous mgs games in a way But i do agree Ray vs Rex was a pretty awesome boss fight. the best one imo.
With the rest of the stuff you mentioned, I agree with and some of them I don't. Yea there are parts of the game that just don't make sense, there are rushed plot points, there is corny dialogue. But I do think Snake was wimpy especially compared to mgs2 snake. Old Snake was old but didnt have to act so old.But the main point also for me is that, with all the problems I had with the game, it kinda ruined it for me. Obviously you didn't feel the same way and thats fine. We just disagree on that. But I aslo think we do agree that there is room for improvement. And hopefully we get that with "Ground Zeroes".
September 14, 2012 at 8:37 PM, said ...
I haven't signed in and over 3 years, but this made me come back to my account. I love Metal Gear!!!! I completely agree you Professor Jeff with the fact in your last loading bar you stated that Solid Snake should not come back he deserves his retirement. What do you think about Johnny doing it he has been in the series for years now.
September 14, 2012 at 8:27 PM, said ...
@Sam
That's actually one of the things I really like about the back and forth in the timeline. Metal Gear 1 and 2 established Big Boss as a traitor, rebel, and the 'bad guy'. Then, MGS 3 went back in time to show you how a loyal soldier and patriot started down the road to becoming the villain. Portable Ops, Peace Walker, and hopefully Ground Zeroes will be the arc that fully flesh out that transformation. On one of the email shows I asked if anyone knew of another franchise that bothered to spend that amount of game time devoted to making you understand the motives of the bad guy. I still can't think of any and it's one of the things I love about these games.
September 14, 2012 at 8:11 PM, said ...
@Sam hes kind of a good guy turned bad, wouldn't you turn bad if your own country fucked you over a bunch of times?
September 14, 2012 at 7:54 PM, said ...
PROFESSOR JEFF. Never played metal gear, just have one question. Why is Big Boss the bad guy, the way you described the story, he sounds like the good guy?
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